Historical accuracy is racist.
By - holymotherofbunnies
From the same people who yell “cultural appropriation”.
##Tumblr's Guide to Casting for Stage and Screen:
**Canonically white character portrayed by white actor:** (eg: Jennifer Lawrence as Katniss Everdeen, Emma Watson as Hermione Granger, Scarlet Johanson as The Major) "This is whitewashing! The book never says she's white! No it doesn't! No, I don't need to READ it, my feels about the text are far more important than the actual words on the page!"
**Canonically white character portrayed by non-white actor:** (eg: Morgan Freeman as Red, Mos Def as Ford Prefect, Idris Elba as Heimdalr) "Wow, I bet all the evil racist Commie Nazi MRA KKK Fuckboys are going to be upset by this! I mean, I've never actually *met* one, but I *imagine* they're going to be royally pissed. Don't they know that race is just a social construct, and all that matters is whether the actor is the most talented person for the role?"
**Canonically non-white character portrayed by white actor:** (eg: Bubblegum Cabbagepatch as Khan Noonien Singh) "ZOMG!! CULTURAL APPROPRIATION!!!1!! That's literally an act of genocide! Yes, **literally**! Race is literally the most important thing to consider when you're casting Coloured People, and next to that, talent is completely irrelevant! Why didn't they even try get a genuine Indian Sikh like Ricardo Montalban?"
**Canonically non-white character portrayed by actor of the appropriate race:** (eg: Too many to count) "Why isn't he ALSO a demisexual homoromantic helicoptergendered modbidly obsese foxkin in a rocket-powered wheelchair? I demand representation of every single one of my fetishes, all in one place, regardless of how little sense that would make to the story! Anything that fails to cater to even one of my fetishes is erasure, which is literally violence! Help, help, I'm being repressed! Come see the violence inherent in the system!"
**Historically white ACTUAL PERSON portrayed by non-white actor:** (eg: Most of the cast of Hamilton) "We have officially colonized this role in the name of the Master Race. We own it now. No white person may ever play it again. Now stop complaining and go back to the Comic Relief reservation."
You can say that any actor should be able to play any role, **or** you can complain about "whitewashing". You can say audiences must be able to identify with characters that look nothing like them **or** you can demand that all of your fetishes MUST be prepresented in EVERY work of fiction.
There is no intellectually honest way to do both. But if it wasn't for double standards, they wouldn't have any standards.
That was a perfect summary.
‘Rocket powered wheelchair’ my sides lol
The ministry of truth invented a rule that says it’s only cultural appropriation when whites do it.
Remember when the internet got up in arms about wypipo being cast in that movie Gods of Egypt? And then it was pointed out that one of the actors was literally Egyptian.
Just think of how it feels to be the black or brown guy on the internet fighting wokeness.
Many Egyptians consider themselves white anyway.
ALSO MUH KKKOLONIALIZM
KING TUTATOOTATOO DATS MY GREAT GREAT GREAT GREAT GREAT GRANDFATHER!
Cultural appropriation rules only go one way.
Only if it involves whites.
The hypocrisy of the libtards clearly shows here.
Whites don't have a culture.
Also, they steal their culture from everyone else.
Also, their culture is so overwhelmingly strong that everyone else is forced to go along with it and forget their own.
Ah yes, cultural materialism, very progressive.
Lol, these people would lose their minds over a Scandinavian girl playing Vishnu, that would be SO problematic.
Another response pulled the "it's fantasy, accuracy doesnt matter" card and I said we should just remake Mulan as a blonde woman then since there's a talking dragon and therefore it doesn't matter.
I'm sure that went over well?
I think it got deleted, lol. As if these same people weren't freaking out about Scarlett Johanson playing a Japanese robot.
Which is especially hilarious because the cyborg body that Motoko used is a Caucasoid. Exact same model as the [Puppet Master.](https://i.pinimg.com/originals/ce/db/5a/cedb5a63ed46fd61789fc81800f9c92a.jpg)
The only people pissed about that were people who didn’t know shit about the anime.
Yep. I still wasn't interested in a remake though. Hollywood ruins good anime.
Visually it looks awesome. But they butchered tf out of the character and story... Still worth a watch for the things it does well though I think.
Name of said anime? Puppet master? Or we talkin ghost in the shell?
I'm referring to the Ghost in the Shell live action movie.
Ah i through it was very good but I never saw the source material so ymmv
Ya I feel ya. I thought Scarjo did well tho. I was pretty happy overall with how it turned out.
Same here. I was incredibly skeptical going into it, being a big fan of the anime.
I must say, I wasn't entirely disappointed with how it turned out.
Hmm, maybe I'll see it at some point.
I for sure would. If you really like the original there are a ton of scenes that they brought to life beautifully.
The best part is that Scarlett Johansson even dyed her hair black for that movie. No-one was like "Motoko Kusanagi is a Nordic blonde now and that's OK because we are Tolerant and Inclusive^TM ".
....He does understand that this is what people had been bitching about the the entire time? Cultural misrepresentation in film?
That's the hypocrisy I pointed out.
I like how theres nothing there anymore. Just a line of "deleted"
That's the "outer appearance" of what they bitch about: the need for stopping cultural appropriation.
But what they're really bitching about is hot white blond men and women and their own jealousy and insecurities.
This is a how-to on converting jealous energies into political propaganda activism.
Jealousy of "power." Jealousy of traditional beauty. Jealousy of "elite". The 3 propagandas: Class warfare, gender warfare, race warfare.
I had first seen instances of these since the 1960s, because the US was viewed as a superpower, their first goal was bashing the US. Not because other countries don't do wrong, but because the US is powerful. Like blaming Microsoft for all the world's technical ills because it's the most powerful company in computers.
That power jealousy is integral to propaganda effectiveness.
Remember the live-action Ghost in the shell?
It isn't about logic, it is about power.
Yeah, that was dumb and I didn't watch it.
Now I would suggest something but I’m not sure if that would be...y’know...
No, that would be racist. ;)
So very very “problematic”. Dare I say “harmful” even.
Didn't they go nuts over Light being portrayed by a white guy in the Death Note movie? Even though he has blond hair in the anime and manga...and ignored L being played by a black guy?
Ngl, that might be a cool thing to watch (I'm Indian).
Should've answered with "cultural appropriation victimizes the storytelling culture"
>"hey there, terrible and racist arguments like this have no place..."
Reddit is basically the California of the internet.
Yep. I didn't want to pull the "I'm not racist because X" card but I'm literally engaged to an Asian man, lol.
So you're trying to breed out the asians? Smh practically genocide
My fiance has a great (and offensive) sense of humor and we joke about our differences and people's perception of them. He always makes a show of ordering me a fork instead of chopsticks when we eat Asian food (even though he's the one that prefers a fork) and will make jokes about my tolerance for spices/hot food and points out every Starbucks we pass, calling it my favorite. I make jokes to him about rice, his driving, and eating our dog. It's all fun ribbing.
So a normal healthy relationship, something those people will never experience nor have the power to comprehend
Geez can you imagine spending your life with someone where you constantly have to think thrice about every joke that you might think is funny because your partner would start ranting at you and accusing you about a bunch of -isms that you're not
I did that for like six months one time. Every movie we saw was an aggression against someone. Certain simple jokes would get twisted into social justice speeches/lectures.
This was one of my first wake-up calls against the woke, and the first instance where I saw an idea had a person instead of vice versa.
I cant see myself being in such a relationship for that long. Guess im just too impatient lol its scary to think you might fall for someone, have all these great memories together and eventually you find out they're insanely woke. They just cant learn how to relax and enjoy life can they?
And after that relationship they probably put none of the blame on themselves and blamed toxic masculinity or something like that for them now being single.
I don't want to imagine that. Yikes. My fiance and I can be as "offensive" as we want to eachother because we both know it's a joke and we love eachother.
It sounds perfect then. Honestly its better to find a relationship like that or not at all
Yep. He's great.
I have a Chinese neighbour below me and Taiwanese neighbour next to me. We’re always joking about the merits of dog over unseasoned chicken
Activists have a goal of killing humor. It gets in the way of their politics of brainwashing.
The majority of Asians and Indians are pretty based. The wokes are minority among us. I am Indian and I have been called racists many times for arguing for more white people in fantasy shows based on European tales, by other whites. LOL
Yeah, my Asian in-laws are based af.
>and eating our dog.
This proves it's true love.
Ok, I am going to need you to get some kind of food or garnish costume for the dog. One morning ask if he wants breakfast in bed. If he says go out and send the dog onto the bed.
And one of my fellow, who also opposing racebendings in historical movies and such, is married to a black African man and has a half-black daughter.
It's not a bad card. If I didn't like Ludi Lin complaying about no East Asians in upcoming Tolkie series with very racially diverse cast but created plenty of East Asian characters myself, nobody with logic would ever attack me with "you just hating seeing East Asian faces and be reminded this race exists" argument. It's clear to anyone sane, what annoys me is their hypercriticalness, demands to include every single minority into every single story.
I would actually love to see fantasy based on Hindu myths. That would be a great opportunity for Indian actors in Hollywood and it would break a lot of cliches based on English sword and sorcery.
See, but that requires creativity and motivation, two things these folks lack all together.
Worse. It's a risk. Hollywood doesn't like those even with white people.
East Asians hardly even count as 'people of colour' anymore these days. And if you'd try that argument, I'm sure that the reprobates would just accuse you of attempting a "my best friend is black, _but_..."-schtick.
Unless you yourself are a dude as well. In that case your own status as member of a designated minority community would give them pause for a few seconds.
But then they'd invariably default to "white gay men are still white men!!1!", and then they'd ban you all the same.
A good chunk of the internet has become the California of the internet.
The internet is fully pussified and commercialized compared to how it was even just ten years ago. Anything that could be considered even remotely “edgy” has been purged from mainstream sites and quarantined into a few endangered echo chambers. Tumblr and liveleak are shells of their former selves. Pornhub is habitually held hostage and forced to negotiate with credit card companies. Google has dropped its “don’t be evil” act and is going full Orwell on dissident thought. Amazon and Microsoft remove sites they don’t like from their servers.
Cesspools like 4chan are the final bastions of the free wheeling, lowercase-L “liberal” internet of the 90s and 2000s that valued free speech and transgressive thought. Everywhere else, including reddit, is ruled by a tyranny of politeness, where everything must adhere to a certain code of banality so as not to scare off ad dollars. As an example, even just calling someone a “jackass” will get your post swiftly deleted on most subs.
This is probabky the best way to describe reddit to someone that has never used it before.
So it's a terrible and racist argument to have a white person play the role of a historically white person, but it's not racist to demand that a black person play the role of a historically black person. Or that only people of color can voice act people of color. If these idiots didn't have double standards then they wouldn't have any standards.
Yeah ppl got so pissed when Tom cruise played that ninja warrior in that one movie.
You mean The Last Samurai? Wasn't it based on an historical event that actually happened?
On a side note; I had heard somewhere they are making another movie like this but based on a black man who escaped a slave ship or something and ended up in Japan. This is also a historical event that actually happened. We should demand that the historically black man be played by Chris Pratt.
Ironically Hollywood made The Last Samurai look like it's an American soldier, but Jules Brunet was very much French lol (also a bit of a Hijikata Toshizō fanboy, which I find cute somehow lol)
Also yes, the story of Yasuke! There's a Netflix anime about it, though it's got much more fantastic in its tone (which I find a bit sad, some dope historical anime on the actual Sengoku era would be well received imo)
Who tf calls himself Paddy Boomsticks anyways.
A racist who hates the Irish, that's who.
(/s but only kinda)
No, there is no s involved. It's literally whats going on. That mod is a heavy virtue signaling cuck, he'd never even dream of naming himself any other racially charged surname.
Am Irish. Can confirm Paddy Boomsticks is racist towards Irish.
Can you explain to me why? Is it like a stereotype kind of irish name?
Oh I was just kidding. They just seem like the type of person to call everything racist so I thought I’d take a funny jab at their name.
Paddy is a nickname for Patrick which is generally a fairly common first and last name used by Irish people. Other Europeans have historically treated the Irish like subhumans and calling them “Paddy” is technically an ethnic slur.
Also, for fun, try calling someone Irish a “Mick”, they generally don’t like it very much. It stems from a lot of Celtic type last names being McAndrews, McNichols, McDonald types. Despite it deriving from actual names it is still technically an ethnic slur.
Both these examples would be like calling every black guy you meet “Tyrone”. It’s all pretty fucking offensive, but in popular culture right now it’s ok if it’s against white people.
Even the term "Paddy Wagon" refers to a police van with room to accommodate multiple prisoners and the term was coined specifically to refer to loading drunken Irishmen into the back to haul them off to jail.
I look forwards to when T'Challa is played by a White South African.
Even better, a Newfie from Canada’s east coast.
Terry Ryan would be an excellent choice.
Says "thank you for your understanding" while holding a gun to your head
What movie was this about?
Do you remember the classic story about the Indian knight Gawain from the Vedic story of King Arthur?
the green knight, Patel plays king Arthur
He played one of the knights of the round table, Gawain.
i got it mixed up sorry
No prob. Arthur is pretty much the only one that gets adapted, so it's an easy mistake.
What happened to cultural appropriation?
History fact: Shaka Zulu was actually a ginger Irishman. This historical fact has been blackwashed by Hollywood
Aint these people the same people who have a meltdown if someone white plays a person who aint white?
What a world we live in. All thats left is to move to eastern Europe by now. It's kinda sad that that is the most normal place by now.
Not for long. They want to change us aswell
This is literally their arguments when a character is white washed
Whitewashing is dumb too.
Reddit is run by retards with no experience outside their cushy neighborhoods. They'd be pissed af if they made black panther white
Honestly, I wouldn't mind it at all if it wasn't for the fact that the race bent casting is OBVIOUSLY politically motivated subversion. Man, they've made me racist.
Exactly. If it wasn't for the hypocrisy, it would be so glaring.
I don't know about that honestly. The worst part about this is the hypocrisy of people who would be up in arms about a white person playing an indian person, but not the reverse. That being said Dev Patel is a great actor and did a great job in the movie, i definitely think it's a huge stretch to say the casting "ruined it". Furthermore he doesn't even look that indian, he's quite fair skinned (ive looked darker at the end of summer than him) and has somewhat caucasian features. It's not like someone straight from bollywood was playing gawain.
Have a white person be the person depicting some sort of Sub Saharan African culture, see how long they’ll support that
Idiots caught between "cUlTuRaL aPpRoPrIaTiOn!" and "bUt InClUsIoN!"
The only racism they don’t see is their own.
Just tell him that if he bans you, that you will report him for moderator abuse.
He already banned me
Here is a form that you can fill out. https://reddit.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/requests/new?ticket_form_id=179106
I wonder how many mods have been disciplined on this site.
Oh but a black girl playing Ariel which is from a European folk tale is fine.
“It’s a well known fact that Britons from several hundred years back were mostly POC.”
"Racist" in one direction, that is. The other way it's natural, creative and brave.
I love Dev Patel (Skins/Lion) but I didn't like the look of this Sir Gawain and The Green Knight film from back when I heard they were working on an adaptation. They wail about representation in historical adaptations yet continue to play the hypocrite's game because "race, woooo!" Not hard to believe but getting harder and harder to swallow
Funny how a white person never plays any other race. They would lose their shit
It has happened a few times and people lost their shit. In old Hollywood it happened all the time. A modern example would be Emma Stone playing a quarter Hawaiian, quarter Asian person with the last name Ng in Aloha despite being super white.
'We are a welcoming and inclusive community, as long as you aren't white.'
**Liberals:** “White people shouldn’t sell tacos. That’s cultural appropriation!”
**Also liberals:** “We’ve discovered an underrepresented minority. Let’s give them top billing, cultural inaccuracies be damned!”
By that logic you could cast trans-atlantic slave traders as native american women and cast the slaves as scottish people and surely there would be no issue.
White liberals are the gatekeepers of racism. They decide what minorites should be offended about. It blows my mind how the same crowd preaching anti-bullying, toLeRaNcE and iNcLuSiOn are the *exact opposite* of that.
Ya I got banned from there for saying woke culture is ruining the genre because people are afraid to write anything that is different from them. I remember a post by a PoC from outside North America/Europe asking if it's ok to write European medieval fantasy. He was worried about cultural appropriation. It made me so sad.
Yeah, that's just sad. In my fantasy writing I draw from all kinds of cultures. I just make sure to do my research and be respectful in my portrayals. This shouldn't be such a issue.
I read an article earlier titled "Can Opera Survive Social Media" or something like that. Apparently there's an opera called "Nixon in China", and now Asian people are upset because white opera singers were cast to play Mao and others. "They're in Yellowface!" , they cry.
A black man plays Nixon. Not a peep from any white people.
Lol the hypocrisy.
Aww how cute, it's retarded...
I’ve heard the term “Inclusive Revisionism” before and think it’s fitting. They’re writing an ethnic character into European folklore for the sake of woke points and it’s painfully obvious. The original manuscript of The Green Knight exists and contains depictions of Sir Gawain, none of which show him having brown skin.
Edit: fixed an autocorrect
Yeah that mod is some self-important shut-in who thinks they’re making a difference on the Internet by shutting down speech. Unfortunately that 90% of Reddit admins.
You didn’t do anything wrong. If anything, you were being very considerate and going out of your way to avoid offense.
I just got a message that they banned me.
Don’t take it personal. It’s just someone taking out their insecurities on you.
I don't. I just laugh at them and enjoy my happy life offline. Reddit mods are nutbars 90% of the time.
I wonder if these are the same people who got pissed off because a British black actress got cast as Harriet Tubman...yeah, she's black, but she isn't the RIGHT KIND of black.
Lol people got mad at that?
*of course* they did
"We are welcoming and inclusive, unless you say anything that we don't agree with."
Talk like this will also get you banned from most of the comic related subs.
This stupid mods just roll over with the most pop opinion, that's gonna fuck reddit
"Thank you for your understanding". Ugh.
It's funny because his statement is just a simple and softly stated opinion that really isn't that controversial but they are going straight to the banhammer. These SJWs are nuts.
Your comments were perfectly valid.
The fact that they removed your comments really pisses me off.
Why stop at race? Why not age and gender fluidity when it comes to portraying characters too? Shaq as pippy longstockings? Angelina Jolie as a young Ice Cube? Harrison Ford as Mulan? Can't miss!
I just dont understand these woke dipshits at all anymore. They just speak put of both sides of their mouths constantly. Its ridiculous.
As someone who dabbles quite a bit in fantasy/sci-settings, theres a lot of woke shit going in there. Unsurprising as many of these fuckers are simps and its their only way to get with women. Thus aligning themselves with the ideological diarrhea that is Feminism.
I write and read fantasy and I too see this pattern.
Take Star Trek, it was a traiblazer in times of diversity when it was actually needed. But because of that, these days its been absolutely hijacked by the woke crowd. Its so utterly crap these days.
I like actual diversity that brings interesting dynamics and stories to a fantasy setting. I love fantasy inspired by different cultures and people. My own fantasy writing has different countries with their own unique cultures, characters who have to fight stereotypes, interracial romance complicated my family expectations, etc. But just switching a character race for diversity points is lazy pandering.
Agreed 100%. Growing up i always believed in a United Colours of Benetton type world but where merit was still the forefront or realistic demographics. As a minority myself, pandering is just fucking insulting.
I feel ya. I'm a woman and hate "girl power" pandering. I just want good stories.
I'm at the very, very beginning baby steps, being horrible stage of writing my own shit.
Those things bother me as well. I have this female character who is a bit of a scammer/thief/can artist type. She is pretty tough, but one of her big conflicts is the fact that when she decided to live like that, she kind of "gave up" on the protections normal women have, like safety and comfort. She can't fall back on her family or be a lady.
So basically she made her bed and then both and the good will come to her.
Sounds cool. My own female characters run the gamut of traditional femininity, from soft and sweet girl to a rebel warrior leader that rides into battle on a magical talking Boar.
Not gonna lie, I want to know more about talking boar. I'm a sucker for creature and animal characters.
Shoot me a message when it becomes available in any way.
Will do. I'm about to start the querying process for my novel. The magical creatures in the story can learn to talk the older and more powerful they get. One magical cat can only yell "yes" or "no" and does do with annoying frequency. Most don't sound entirely human. Some have better vocabularies, but have very creepy, uncanny valley type voices. Think the forest animals in the English dub of Princess Mononoke.
Man, I love Dev Patel, dude’s fuckin awesome, and I’m sure he’s gonna kill it as Arthur. Still, Dev Patel is not King Arthur. He can play the part well, he just won’t be Arthur.
*Sir Gawain, but yes, I agree. He's great. I've loved him all the way back when he was in Skins. But he's not Sir Gawain.
my bad, mixed my knights up
Easy mix up when they only seem to adapt Aurthur and no one else. I'd like to see more, honestly.
Isn't that the whole argument for cultural appropriation?
Welcome to the new age racism. Instead of telling a black story with black people, they re-run an old white story and throw some black faces on it. It's sad.
Brothers, when will you learn that leftists have zero self awareness and are allergic to logic?
I dont get why when they cast a minority to play someone who is usually white, its powerful and a movement, but if they cast a majority to play a character who is a minority, they get all mad. Like choose one, either we have historical accuracy ALWAYS, or race doesnt matter in terms of acting. Personally, I would choose the second, but the 1st is fine too.
Remember the fucking shitstorm with ghost in the shell or dr strange? Iron man 3?
I felt the same way when the BBC did their show where Anne Boleyn, an actual historical character (not one from myths/legends like Gawain), was played by a black actress.
That was more egregious to me because Dev looks definetely more European than Jodie Turner-Smith.
"I like Dev Patel, but he doesn't fit the role"
I thought the sub was called fantasy because they like the genre, not because they are living in one.
I want pedro Pascal to be the next black phanter, if someone complain then is racist
One of those things that's only racist when white people do it lol
"I like Dev Patel."
"You racist piece of shit, how dare you?!"
Just announced Gilbert Gottfried is playing MLK in a new biopic. I’m sure the left will be totally ok with that.
Holy shit I would pay to see that.
For every 1 scandanavian on earth there is something like 10 Indians in India alone.
Once scandinavians are completely extinct, will Indians be given the green light to claim all Scandi achievments?
Will Ethiopia be given the achievements of Ireland? Who will get Italy's achievements? Will it be Mexico? post color-revolution syria?
Edited to add: It is actually a lot more than 10 indians. If we go with 1 billion Indians, vs 50 million scandis, we get 1:20. I am not sure of the real numbers. I spent a year in Sweden though back before the genocide of mass immigration began. There are only 10 million swedes in Sweden. They can be completely wiped out by 1 single decade of USA-levels of mass immigration. USA right now takes in 1-2 million new, mostly indigent, illegal immigrants per year. 10-20 million per decade. More than the entire populations of places like Ireland, Sweden, Estonia, etc.
Make a movie about Genghis Khan and cast Hugh Jackman.
I like Dev Patel a lot. I didn’t care for Slumdog Millionaire that much (not that it was bad, it was just okay), but that was my first encounter with Dev and he was awesome. Also amazing in Chappie and even The Last Airbender. He’s an amazing actor.
That is why I’m not *pissed* that he’s Gawain, but it is definitely weird. And there is very clearly a double standard at play.
Yeah, I'm not mad at him, just the blatant double standard.
Yeah, can’t be mad at an actor for getting a job. If the studio wants to be woke/culturally appropriate, then that’s on them.
They could have just made a movie about one of the “Moorish” knights, because Dev could pass for that. But….
Mods being retarded on reddit. Business as usual
I had a similar complaint with Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla. The game has an Asian, female Viking warrior. I know the series is known for its creative freedom when it comes to historical events, but that shit is just plain pandering
I'm still waiting for Tom Cruise to star as Shaka Zulu, or Ethan Hawk as MLK. Something tells me the people ok with race swapping historical white figures would take umbrage at that.
Honestly, being r/fantasy, I think political correctness fits the sub pretty well
HOL UP, Alladin was Asian; I believe Chinese to be correct.
So you're either racist because you think that cultures should represent themselves only... or you're racist because you think one should "culturally appropriate" from another.
But if you're a SJW or a colored person it's ok.
Until you're a white SJW and someone decides it's not ok anymore.
And you need someone with the authoritarian right-think to tell you how to correct your wrong-think.
It all just depends on... Whatever they decide in the moment...
Got it. All makes sense now.
Totally get where you're coming from and I agree with the sentiment completely. However, in Scheherazade's Thousand and One Arabian Nights, Aladdin is a Chinese boy IIRC, so a Korean would be closer than say, ANY kind of Middle Easterner. As such, Disney is yet another Asian erasure proponent 🌝
Fun fact: Aladin was originally Chinese