T O P
SolidStone1993

The only problem I have with MCC’s progression system is that once you hit level 100 you stop getting season points from leveling up. Then it really becomes a slog and xp ends up completely worthless. Remove that cap and it would be absolutely perfect.


HankTheYank27

I agree. Like I said in the original post, it's not perfect but I think it should've been the basis for Halo Infinite to be built upon. If MCC still gave points for levelling it would be a lot better. What I think MCC does MUCH better is giving fair challenges that cater to every kind of player. Some of them are a little harder if you're not good at PvP but still not as bad or as FOMO as Halo Infinite's.


Prefix-NA

MCC can only give u 12 per week max. It would take minimum 9 weeks to max out a season pass if u got every Legendary challenge done each week without missing any. Plus MCC has weekly exchange stuff as well.


inFINN1te

It is worth mentioning that while it sucks you can only get 12 per week max. That's still not THAT bad. That's 12 tiers in a week. And that is still AFTER getting a whole ass 100 just for leveling you reach that limit. Not only that, but you're disregarding seasonal challenges which give you 3 or 4 points a pop often. Which add up as well. It's still a lot better than you're currently making it out to be.


Prefix-NA

There are 6 seasons + Weekly unlocks + the bundle unlocks. You only get first one free from the limit. Seasonable challenges give about 16 total for a whole season so I guess in 7-8 weeks u can complete just a battlepass if u max out. Not counting the 20point bundles.


inFINN1te

Okay but there's 8 different passes. You can spend them on whatever you want. I think I've filled out about 450 tiers plus probably about 25 points spent on the Exchange as well. So I'll say 475. Clearly the progression works well in practice. Between the first 100 points, all the challenges you'll get along the way weekly and seasonal, you have a lot of shit you can get. It's really just not that bad even if not perfect. And it's not like you have to fill out a pass. Just get what you want there's 8 of them. Despite how much shit I have I also have never filled out a pass because I don't want everything from any one pass and I very highly doubt most people do either.


Trevor-On-Reddit

Whenever I complain about the cap everyone says "Its hard to level up after level 100 anyways" and I to this day still don't get that argument. A) I'm pretty sure the leveling system is the exact same even after level 100. B) Even if it is, getting season points from leveling up, even though it takes a while, is still better than nothing.


SolidStone1993

I personally don’t like that leveling eventually gets to a point where doing multiple challenges still doesn’t level you up. There needs to be a cut off point to increasing the required xp for each level. It should never take more than 100,000 xp to level up.


HankTheYank27

You see, I agree with you and used to complain about it too until I saw how much worse it can get with Infinite. I want them to use MCC as a base but that doesn't mean there shouldn't still be further improvements. MCC just needs to either reward points for levelling or just give a point for every challenge.


UpfrontGrunt

It gets exponentially harder after level 100. Level 100 is less than 1% of the total XP needed for max level. Level 200 is less than 6%. Level 300 is 51.66%, or 662,609,000 XP. It's not even remotely the same past 100 and by that point the grind per level is longer than finishing the Infinite battle pass.


seelay

Hitting that cap made me lose so much drive for playing the game. After that level, the only challenges that earn you anything are just grindy. I don’t want to pay attention to challenges while I play sometimes but if I don’t now I don’t get rewarded at all


TheFourtHorsmen

How tou could play 600+ game more than infinite, in the same amount of time? Also,pretty sure once you cap your rank in mcc (something i did during the reach season), you are forced to grind weekly challenges that give you max 6 tokens, and seasonal, which give you around double the amount. Something is suspicious here


popstable

Dude oddball games can last 21 min+. I hate how long some games on infinite take. 5 flags?!?


BoyWonder343

That is the outlier though. Oddball games can also be sub 5 minutes.


popstable

Competitive, not one sided games, surely last closer to 10+min on average.


BoyWonder343

That's what I mean. If we're talking about the average time to finish a game relative to MCC, you can't bring up an outlier as the justification for the difference. Especially one that, based on your numbers, is over twice as long as an average game.


popstable

Honestly, I’d love to know how much of an outlier 20+min games are. I seem to have a lot, but I’m sure it’s biased recall, where I remember the longer ones more than 10min ones.


sherril8

I just looked at my last 11 Oddball games (ranked Diamond 2 matches) and the longest was 16.3 minutes with the average of all 11 being 10.9 minutes.


TheFourtHorsmen

You want to tell me this guy is a pro player in mcc and can end up, on avarage, every game in sub 10 minutes but on infinite he will go for twice the amount on each game? Numbers still don't come to me, if I could look at his profile with stats on both game, sure, but I would like to see also how much time he spent on pve, because at least half of the challenges comes from campaign/firefight. Let's be real here, this sound like a bs, the "delta drop" challenge alone, if that's the correct name, can already take away 7 hours of play time for one token, and is usually rolled every 2 weeks


occupyOneillrings

Slayer vs objective games would explain it no?


trap4pixels

Yeah swat games often are like 5-6 min


Venusaurite

Delta Droppings? Is that the 'complete 3 H2/H3 ODST levels' challenge? No challenge in MCC takes long, especially if you grind the PvE challenges directly. That said yeah his MCC number seem very sus. 400 challenge points unlocked in 115 hours with 900 games played? Idk man edit: Oh I skipped the part where he said he doesn't include campaign stuff, except that's where half your points come from after 100 levels so its super relevant to the stats he should be including..


Spookypanda

Gsme time is less then 20 minutes....


TheFourtHorsmen

On quick play is 3 flags to score, aside that, is not like you will always play oddball, like i think this dude didn't play 900 games on br slayer in h3, for some tokens you need to go on pve, for others in ranked, where the Qup drastically imcrease


Spookypanda

Just wanna leave this a bit higher up. I Just checked my match history. In 12 games the shortest was 8:49 oddball on live fire and the longest was 16:19 strongholds on streets with a score of 250:247. I ONLY play ranked. Meaning 2 more flag captues to win a game, 50 more points on strongholds, and no change to 50 score in slayer. That means that ranked objective modes take even longer then unranked objective modes, which according to him take longer then slayer. With the other 10 games being between 9:24 - 12:38 not a single game went to his "average" game length of nearly 20 minutes.


TheFourtHorsmen

I think the only game mode that was, on avarage, 20 minute long, in the entire halo history, was warzone before the big patch. I can see the real reason about this post: bitching about no slayer and the BP at the same time, but he did quite the opposite, at least here


Spookypanda

Yeah sorry i kind of piggy backed your comment so more people would see this. >bitching about no slayer and the BP at the same time, but he did quite the opposite, at least here Agreed. This wasnt fair criticism, this was anger and misrepresentation


HankTheYank27

Well I explained it. This is admittedly not a 1:1 comparison because many of the the tiers I earned in MCC were campaign challenges. In fact, I typically get all of the PvE stuff done every week but often don't finish all of the PvP challenges mostly because I'm not worried about it and don't really chase the objective challenges or the ranked challenges which means that I'm playing games that don't count because they aren't the correct mode. That leads me to my next explanation of time spent. In MCC, because I am able to chose what game modes I play I am able to chose mostly slayer which typically lasts less than half of the amount of time an objective mode takes and less than a third of the amount of the time a total control or oddball match in Halo Infinite can take which I am often forced to play. My experience in Halo Infinite so far has been only about 1 in 5 games are slayer. In the OP you can read that MCC tracks how much time you have spent IN A MATCH, not in the lobby or anything else. I've spent 115 hours in matches. I don't have a way of seeing that for Halo Infinite so like most others on this sub, I'm posting overall time in the game as a whole because Xbox tracks that. In reality it's probably closer to 90 hours or less instead of 103. I haven't tried to do any math and this is all based on estimations anyway but when most of your games are lasting about half as long or less in some cases then it scales pretty well. If it took approximately 90 hours to play 300 matches of Halo Infinite in mixed modes and 115 hours to play 900 matches of mostly slayer in MCC then it can be estimated to take 45 hours or less to play just slayer matches in Halo Infinite which adds up to 135 hours for the same amount of games. This is all hypothetical but it starts making more sense when you break it down. Also, I have no idea how accurate MCC or Xbox Live is at tracking hours played. Also also, it could in fact be even less than 90 hours which would bring the number even closer because there is a lot of down time in lobbies to consider.


smegdawg

>This is admittedly not a 1:1 comparison because many of the the tiers I earned in MCC were campaign challenges. So why present it as one?


DethFireHate

Because he has an agenda to push


deeleelee

because this sub will upvote literally ANYTHING critical of the H:I battlepass


HankTheYank27

I didn't? I literally said in the first line of the post that it included campaign challenges dude. I mentioned it again in the fourth paragraph. I really wish people would actually read stuff before they pull out their pitchfork.


mark0001234

I suspect your maths are out. Halo Infinite games take about the same amount of time as MCC games. I don’t think Slayer is quicker than objective games - it takes quite a while to get 50 kills, while objective games often finish very quickly. You have played almost 3 times as many games in MCC as Halo Infinite and I’m pretty sure you will have spent about 3 times as much time in MCC multiplayer as Halo Infinite. And you have played the MCC campaign.


Spookypanda

>In reality it's probably closer to 90 hours or less instead of 103. Yeah if you don't close the application it runs in the background and counts time. So not only is this presented as a 1:1 comparison when it isn't, but its not even close to reputable. Why not use the xbox tracked time for MCC and infinite..... straight misrepresentation


HankTheYank27

Except I literally made the fourth paragraph to point that out. You cannot accuse someone of "straight misrepresentation" if you failed to acknowledge their full statement. I did not present it as 1:1 either. To have done so would have been to have never mentioned the times are not 100% paired up. If you're going to be that semantical about my time played then I'd suggest you also question everyone else who are mentioning their time played because most people are pulling that number from the same place I did. I used the more accurate number for MCC because I had it. And if I were to include total play time on MCC that would also include all of the total play time from before they even had a battle pass and the game was out for *years.* If anything, that would be the bigger misrepresentation.


TheFourtHorsmen

Dude listen, I don't want to attack you or anything like that, but you pointed out the post as a comparison between the 2 games. Despite the fact there is no need to be a genius to see how the math was wrong, you omitted the time spent on single player to grind the tokens. Even if the argument was "with afresh account a reached more in the same hour in mcc", the point was still wrong, because: mcc give you bonus tokens in the first levels, after it you have to earn them through challenges which gives you only 6 tokens per week, plus 12 per season (or something more, still..)


HankTheYank27

Well I wasn't using an accurate enough source for the time played stats and have since been made aware of a more accurate source so I updated as much as I could in the OP but you can't change the title unfortunately. My main point was to compare matches played rather than time but people seem to be more interested in the time played despite a lot of the body of my original post being dedicated to match count. Should've kept it more simple. I mentioned that campaign challenges were included in those stats but again, no one really noticed that. I will not post the time I've spent playing campaign because it's not very accurate. I have played more campaign just to play it and to beat it than I have for the sake of challenges and I played a lot of campaign before they added the new progression system to MCC. MCC gives you 100 points for the first 100 levels then drops down to 12 weekly points every week and about 25 season points every season. I feel that including the first 100 is justified because it's a legitimate part of the progression track that every player will experience. Again, as was mentioned in the OP, it's not perfect but I personally feel that MCC has a lot more going for it's progression system than Halo Infinite.


mgarcia993

Every Xbox game should follow what Rare did with SoT, there is exclusive content to the Store, but there is also content for playing the game, and the Plunder Pass is really good.


Sharpie1993

SoT is amazing, their cosmetic store doesn’t feel bad at all because they actually have so many free cosmetics to earn and you can earn the special coins. There are actually that many free cosmetics that most pirates don’t have to look the same.


subaqueousReach

They definitely improved the game a lot since it's launch issues. My only concern now is there's two primary issues with the game: The Tall Tales glitch a lot. I still haven't completed the second PoC one because I was an hour in, got stuck on a rock and it teleported me to the ocean surface by my boat. I was able to swim back down and catch up with my crew, but then it happened again and this time the paths were sealed. They fought the kraken without me. The other issue is the enemy entity limit being non existent. Even something as simple as finding a buried chest turns into SoT Zombie Survival because of how many enemies spawn at once. I absolutely love the new enemy variety, but I don't like fighting a horde of skeletons, ghosts and crabs every time I make a pit stop when I only have 5 rounds of ammo. Having 15 merfolk show up when I'm plundering a sunken ship almost makes it not worth plundering lol


jcrankin22

Those definitely are pretty minor issues with the game that popped up recently. They're pretty good about fixing balancing and enemy spawn issues. I'm more concerned that hit registration during combat is still an issue 3 years later and they are limited in what they can now add to the world since Unreal engine is so limiting. Ships are already spread thin with so much going on in the world.


RocinanteLOL

They’ll never fix hitreg, they can’t. It’s not like they haven’t tried.


MrNature73

My issue with SoT is I feel like there's no reason for me to play though because it's ONLY cosmetics. I can't upgrade my gear, or earn new gear. There's no real treasure to find, you know? I can't find some cool ancient sword and actually have it behave differently than the normal sword. Nothing. Same for the ships, which is even more egregious imho. There's not even any side grades. I can't tune my ship in any way.


Sych0tic

I was surprised by that when I first started the game for the Halo themed items. I played for maybe 3 hours and I already made my pirate look like my ideal hunter/mercenary. Its nuts.


Duck274

it's also possible to earn the premium currency in game


pek217

Yea, I got tons of cool stuff from the premium store on their Black Friday sale without spending anything at all, I had enough just from playing!


smegdawg

> Rare did with SoT, Release a very very shallow game and wait a year to improve it and make it what it should have been at launch???


havesuome

This is the second person I’ve seen comparing this game with SoT not making the connection that SoT took at least a year and losing most of its playerbase to become what it is.


smegdawg

Yep, I've seen a few. The Rose Colored Glasses are strong around these parts.


badmanbad117

YEAH! I want cats that follow my spartan around!


Taaargus

SoT isn’t a F2P game. I understand why that upsets some people, but of course a F2P game isn’t going to have the same cosmetic model as a $40 one.


The_Ninja_Master

Well SoT isn't free, Infinite is. That's the difference at the end of the day.


Jewkneeur13

I’m 105 hours ,645 matches, and level 96 or 97. Take away my 25 tiers I’m 71 or 72. How do you have less than half of my matches in almost the same time. Something off.


hairy_bipples

OP totally isn’t lying or exaggerating his point in an attempt to find another excuse to hate infinite


[deleted]

I don't think he is, I have 10 hours and am level 5. Going at that rate ill be level 50 by 100 hours.


LittleLight85

>if we don’t win this war Jfc go away with this crap. You’re not in a war. This is so cringe.


arbynthebeef

They have changed how xp has been handled twice already. Your math is wrong and this post is disingenuous. There is still 4 months left in this pass, I'm sure you will be just fine.


HankTheYank27

I'm not worried about me. I literally have all the free time I need to finish it. I'm worried about people who have busier lives than I and can't no life a game like I can. Most of my friends aren't even tier 20. In fact, many of them haven't made it past tier 10. People are busy and life comes before video games. Also, some people genuinely have a very hard time completing the weekly challenges.


MisterChief343

You don’t have to worry about our busy lives and schedules. We’ll take care of it and find time to play whenever we can lol


petermekking

I work 40 hours a week, got a girlfriend, try to hit the gun like three times a week and I’m at level 44. Got nothing to complain.


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ELVEVERX

140+ days left


_BallsDeep69_

Let me get this straight - you're upset that you're already halfway into a battlepass that's supposed to last you until May of 2022? That's 4 months and 3 weeks from now. You got halfway through it and the game isn't even fully released yet lol man y'all complain about the dumbest shit


snowe99

Not only that, but he enjoys a game that he played 115 hours of (over who knows how long) vs a game that he put 100 hours into over the course of (*checks notes*) like 4 weeks? I don’t understand Reddit sometimes man. I have never in my life done 100 hours/month of something that frustrated me/didn’t bring me joy. Also, the fact that 343 got that many hours out of him in launch month, I bet they’d see that as an absolute win.


_BallsDeep69_

It goes to show that 343 made a fantastic product. The packaging sucks dick but the product itself is great. Eventually the shit will be ironed out in updates but gameplay and mechanics are just solid.


Just2_Stare_at_Stars

I wish people understood this. Too busy karma mining and brigading and co-opting thread topics to insert just one more sarcastic, "novel" voicing of the same old shit that 343 already knows...because we told it to them. A lot! ...Not sure how people here missed that part. They probably didn't even see where 343 responded and agreed to action it already too. Or the part where they stated weeks ago after Nov. 15 that some fixes would have to come post-launch.


Ronln_Prime

Ahh yes complain about others complaining. The cycle is rich in nutrients


Silly_Elevator_3111

Did you ever try using the “complain about complainers” outside of the internet?


t-visADL

Action it by saying Slayer, the most staple mode to date, needed to have its feasibility assessed. Ok.


Owobowos-Mowbius

Absolutely. The game is fantastic and I just have to hope that the rest of it will be fixed as we move forward. I enjoy the game itself and that's the most important thing for me.


Spookypanda

Not only that. He literally could not have put the amount of time he has into infinite into MCC on its launch. It didnt work for like 6 months. Not only that!!! He spent 115 hours in infinite FOR FREE


Turbulent_Link1738

It’s only been 3 weeks actually


Just2_Stare_at_Stars

Don't worry, the second highest comment in this thread is not relevant to OP's specific topic, nor does it even consider that OP is wrong (it's just another spamming of general cynicism and sarcasm that is SO UNIQUE AND HOT OF A TAKE...IVE NEVER SEEN THIS HERE!!1). People are off their rockers at this point. It's borderline pathetic how easy people abandon even-keel, reasonable responses to problems and challenges (that is, no, I don't think 343 have done things right or perfectly at all, but learn to have a fucking conversation like an adult??? 343 are communicating with us consistently and *for a reason*).


mattwinkler007

Yeah I'm kinda scratching my head at this one - it's roughly the same amount of hours to get through approximately half of the tiers. The interesting point it brings up is that the games he's played last three times longer on average, which isn't necessarily a pro or a con, or related to the structure of the battle pass. Besides that, if the hardcore crowd had completed every tier already, pretty sure some folks would just complain about not having anything to do instead \*shrugs\*


Spookypanda

He is using MCCs in game time which is specifically time spent IN GAME vs the time xbox records him having infinite open. So basically he misrepresented this like crazy.


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ThatPancakeMix

Right?? I’m all for the complaints about lack of dedicated playlists, normal progression/career statistics, etc… but complaining about the game not being easy enough to finish within a month or two? Shouldn’t it be like, difficult to finish an entire goal of a game? Lol


Taaargus

More than that, he’s comparing the cosmetic system of a $40 game to a free game. It’s an even more useless criticism than you’re saying.


HankTheYank27

>I honestly don't mind how long it's taken. I have plenty of free time to kill. In fact I probably have more free time than you do or the vast majority of users on this sub and that's what concerns me. Normal people have jobs, school, families, hobbies and other games to have to juggle. Most of my friends aren't past tier 20 yet. The other HUGE problem is the lack of meaningful progression which is one of the main points of the OP. In Halo Infinite, if you're not completing a weekly challenge then you aren't given much of anything and that just FEELS bad. In a day and age where every single game, movie and show are all competing for my precious free time I really would like to feel like I accomplished something when I grind out a hard fought victory in a game mode I don't even want to play but am forced to. If you didn't buy the battle pass then there is practically nothing to work towards and therefor no reason to log in every day or even once a week which is just as important for the game's health as players buying the pass. Copy pasted from another one of my replies. Sorry but there's just to many to reply to.


My_Third_Prestige

If someone is level 12.5 by now then they're on pace to hit 100 by the end of season. (This doesn't count boosts obtained by rewards).


Atwalol

I swear to god, the guys complaining the most dont wanna play a game for fun. They constantly need some arbitrary award for playing. I got Halo Infinite MP for free and I'm having a blast. I couldn't care less about cosmetic shit.


MisterChief343

Dude what are you on about? I have been away for work and on vacation for almost three weeks. I don’t play much but when I do I try to play as much as I can. I’m at level 28 I think and I’m completely fine with it. I have enough time to level to 100 by the time the season pass is over. This is the reason why we can finish the season pass whenever ever we want. To take our time.


Hopadopslop

He is a power leveler, that is expected. I myself am only level 5 because this progression system sucks.


DarthMatu52

This is just wrong. Someone already did the math on the new XP rates, and if you play only 3 games a day--including bot games--you will complete the Battle Pass with 5 days left to spare. This is just not a fair comparison. MCC didn't use this model, at all, this is a F2P model much like Valorant, the Battle Pass should take longer


Elite1111111111

Yup. MCC actually has fairly low hardcap on your weekly progression. Infinite has a softcap once you do your weeklies and first few dailies, and you aren't likely to hit the hardcap unless you play nothing but bot matches. MCC's progression is currently far more strict on someone joining late in the game. With Infinite, we'll hopefully see some more changes before we get that far. As it stands, doing your weeklies and the first 6 dailies would get you done in I think about 7 weeks. I'm just basing this off my experience of earning about 8 levels while doing the weeklies before that second daily change, so that'd be roughly 15 levels a week now.


Gowapowa

Hates game, spends 100 hours playing it.


ScrubbingIncognito

Yeah but isn't this about right then? You've played similar hours and are a little more than halfway through the content? The amount of games played is crazy. Is that more attributed to you playing a particular mode?


Mr_The_Captain

The vast majority of the information in this post is useless as it was before the XP boost last week. If the game launched with what we have now you would be in the 70’s with the same amount of time invested. Delete this, it only serves to spread misinformation and foster unwarranted* negativity *unwarranted because, to be clear, this post is based on data that is no longer relevant in any way whatsoever


FollowerOfKek_FOK

How dare you critisize a system that takes away your money and your enjoyment of the game? What are you smart or something?


Taaargus

The actual criticism of this take is he’s comparing the cosmetic system of a $40 game to one that’s free. So, no, Infinite specifically does not take away your money.


Castro3man

yeah, it just gives me less value for my money than any Halo game.


Taaargus

I mean, you’d kind of have to wait for 6 battle passes before you can really say that. Yea, if all the other battle passes are like this one, you’re probably right. And yea, buying 3 $20 skins in the store doesn’t add up to what you had previously. But if your concern is being able to work towards cosmetics, the moment we heard this was a F2P game it was obvious that battle passes were going to be the main thing for “progression”, and we don’t have $60 worth of passes yet.


ELVEVERX

>if all the other battle passes are like this one, you’re probably right not really, there was 13 helmets in this battle pass and I believe there is 2 in the event there was like 23 in reach. so in 2 seasons we will have more armour than reach.


Bignuka

Look at mister smarty pants over here, wanting a fair system lol


MobileVortex

What's not "fair"? How fast your progress bar moves?


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HankTheYank27

I honestly don't mind how long it's taken. I have plenty of free time to kill. In fact I probably have more free time than you do or the vast majority of users on this sub and that's what concerns me. Normal people have jobs, school, families, hobbies and other games to have to juggle. Most of my friends aren't past tier 20 yet. The other HUGE problem is the lack of meaningful progression which is one of the main points of the OP. In Halo Infinite, if you're not completing a weekly challenge then you aren't given much of anything and that just FEELS bad. In a day and age where every single game, movie and show are all competing for my precious free time I really would like to feel like I accomplished something when I grind out a hard fought victory in a game mode I don't even want to play but am forced to. If you didn't buy the battle pass then there is practically nothing to work towards and therefor no reason to log in every day or even once a week which is just as important for the game's health as players buying the pass.


DethFireHate

But you didn't say any of that in your post? You had a clear narrative you wanted to push despite your 3rd grade level napkin math being completely flawed.


BottomSidewaysText2

Ah yes because grinding 100s of hours for a different color emblem is so enjoyable.


alfabetsoop

If you don't enjoy playing that way, don't do it... Are people forcing themselves to not have fun with a videogame?


Sparkyisduhfat

Remember when people actually played games because they were fun and not just for cosmetics and meaningless xp?


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GamerChef420

No one asked them to make multiplayer free to play. Could have just been included with the full game like every single other fucking release of Halo in the past 17 years. The only reason it’s free to play it so they can sell shit in their store and then when people complain about the price they go “it’s a free game”. But please continue to talk about how Microsoft…. the company that’s worth $2 trillion spent so much money on this game.


000pugsly

What’s not fair is less product for the same money. You use to get a full campaign, multiplayer, customisation and an abundance of modes. Now your money will get you a campaign. The free to play is a shield used to excuse shitty marketing tactics and lack of features. The products they do sell are ridiculously overpriced and hope to capitalise of fans love for the series, nostalgia and by boring the players into progressing with money by deliberately making the game less fun than it could be. No one wanted the free to play model, no one asked for it. Halo would have always shipped with multiplayer. Instead they pretend it’s separate, charge full whack for the campaign and fill the now gutted multiplayer with egregious transactions. That’s whats not fair.


HankTheYank27

One of my friends had a pretty spicy take last night... In his opinion Battlefield 2042 is the best multiplayer shooter that came out this fall. Now I know what you're thinking. "Hwat!?" you say to yourself. Well, Battlefield 2042 has some of the best custom game features and support of any game out now. More so than Halo Infinite. And not only can you make whatever you want but the game launched with a custom game browser to let people match into it. I had to admit he had a point. Something to think about.


000pugsly

I think having a robust set of features can go a long way to gaining good will though. People get worked up because they want to love something haha


alfabetsoop

The system is built to take your money if you're willing to buy stuff. How's it taking your enjoyment of the game away?


MissplacedLandmine

Im surprised people still need to ask this Having a custom spartan is awesome… theres already no rewards for doing well (let alone cool armor pieces ) How the hell are we the villains for wanting something thats been one of the staples of Halos progression both in multiplayer and campaign? It just feels empty without it, and the fact its a direct and deliberate result of greed just makes it feel worse Having a bunch of fun on the MCC still and as fresh as Halo infinite is? Looks like it comes with a price, freemium isnt free 🤷🏻‍♂️ Also wow to all the bad decisions so far that we have all reiterated


alfabetsoop

>Having a custom spartan is awesome Sure, but it's not part of playing the game. >no rewards for doing well Except having fun? Maybe pulling your team to a win? >It just feels empty without it If this game feels empty to you, might wanna find a different game. >freemium isnt free Hasn't ever been, never will be. You release a game that takes years to develop for free, you have to make a profit somehow. The store and the way 343 is handling their monetization is pretty shitty. But it's completely separate from the actual, REALLY FUN game they released. So, like I said - built to take your money? Absolutely. Taking any enjoyment from the game itself? Not at all.


clain4671

isnt technically every product ever made built to take your money? feel like i see lots of people shocked, SHOCKED to see gambling in this establishment.


alfabetsoop

'I bought this coffee maker... now they're asking me to buy the coffee itself! What's the point of a coffee maker if it doesn't MAKE COFFEE?? And don't even get me STARTED on sugar. The whole system is intended to bleed you dry!'


MissplacedLandmine

The specific challenges are a bit counter intuitive for the fun of the game via winning thing. Even if i ignore them other focus on them And yeah been doing MCC and other stuff Just sucks Halo is in the state it is


MissplacedLandmine

Also taking enjoyment out of the game is a person by person opinion just because youre cool with it doesnt mean I am 🤷🏻‍♂️ I suppose neither of us can say it definitively. That said you benefit even slightly if they fix this shit sooo


alfabetsoop

No. The challenges might dilute the fun you can have on the menus. They have nothing to do with the actual gameplay. That's a definite, no opinion involved.


MissplacedLandmine

Clearly youve never heard the phrase that ends in “leave a pretty corpse” Also the split second my enemy is distracted by my wonderful majesty/drip gives me an extra edge for the kill, needed or not Gotta say man the only wrong answer here is one thats “absolute”


Atwalol

It's not freemium, you can play everything in the game for free. You have to pay if you wanna play dress-up.


MissplacedLandmine

First of all youll never get into the big leagues esport customization wise with that attitude Second of all Yall falling over yourselves for the opportunity to act like they didnt gut portions of the game and separate it from campaign etc Not okay. And ima damn well play dress up like I want to


Atwalol

The game is literally free. I've been playing unlimited Halo MP for 0 (zero) dollars. You guys wanna play barbie dress up. Play the game.


LobotomyJesus

MCC was $60 at retail with strictly old content. They couldn't have possibly charged a premium BP for it.


blooboytalking

So... you'll be done 5 months before the BP is over?


Ninjawitz

If people want to keep giving you shit. I have 77 hrs played at tier 58 and I have finished all of my challenges each week and no I shouldnt have to rely on boosters. I did go from 32 to 58 over this last week though.


Wickedcell

You must be terrible at the game or at math because I have 38 hours and I’m level 35 on the pass. I’m so fucking tired of these posts by trash players with trash opinions.


starscream1479

62 hours played - battle pass level 46 having an absolute blast the whole time. do you guys play the game for fun or just purely for the meager cosmetic items.


Buzzd-Lightyear

“I’ve no-lifed this free game for over 100 hours in less than a month and it hasn’t given me all the rewards. This other, full price game with an entirely different monetization model practically spoon fed me in comparison!” Is what I’m getting from this post. You sound entitled as hell and need to get out and do something else with your time.


ShadowCloud04

I think I would just like seeing something else added on top. Right now with how much I play once I hit Saturday maybe Sunday I have no challenges left. Sooo…. That means after the first 6 games I only get the 50. The game plays awesome so it’s ok, but I’d like a little more. Something to make that end of week time feel more fulfilling progress wise.


AdonisGaming93

That's why they fixed the progression. Now you basically are guaranteed 1-2 rank ever 2-3 hours. Much faster now.


HankTheYank27

Yes because everyone has time to play 2-3 hours a day. I know one guy who literally can only play video games 1 day a week. That's a lot more common than you think.


Bcami

Played MCC for a while, was only able to complete the REACH pass. Been playing Halo Infinite and am at Level 56 without purchasing any levels. 2XP helps


lil-dlope

Damn I just started so I’m at like 5-6 hours hitting level 8. I hope they add a batter progression bc this is damn near slower than six siege bp


GeebGeeb

You’re almost 1/10th of the way done in 6 hours for a pass that is months long. It’s not slow at all


lil-dlope

Yea I’m starting to notice it’s going by pretty quick, it’s just a lot of ppl were complaining about it so I thought I wouldn’t complete it.


[deleted]

The crazy thing is, is that MCC was an obvious test to see how players were going to like the battle pass, progression, match composer etc. Thought for sure that's what we were going to expect for Infinite


Traditional_Exit_445

MCC is such a Gem of a game. So happy the out the time and love into it.


SinLust00

The combination of both MCC and Reach’s progression system would’ve made Infinite’s progression god tier, yet they didn’t incorporate any of it and just went with the default battle pass game progression and hide the better stuff behind pay walls


sharkvenom1

I prefer it the way it is gives me something to do.


HankTheYank27

That's fair. I have felt like I had plenty to do in MCC this past year without feeling the need to grind it every single day to make any progress. I have friends who bought all the tiers and I have pointed out that they have literally nothing to work towards.


thtmusicianguy

I'm at 165 matches but only 24 hours....and Battlepass Level 36... It could be faster but there's alot more that could be wrong.


HankTheYank27

How many bot matches did you play? Those are speedy. How many double XP boosts did you use? Did you buy any tiers? In reality, my time played is probably more around 90 hours or less but I can't see the time spent in matches. Only overall, menus included.


thtmusicianguy

Check on Halo tracker I've only done 3 or 4 bot matches. (they aren't fun tbh) I've used one double XP boost. And I have bought no tiers, only the premium battlepass but not the bundle.


DJ-ScoopyB

This is some “Bad faith argument” hall of fame level stuff. Glad most people are seeing through it. Just looking at the average time per game (7.5 min for MCC compared to nearly 20 per Infinite) and that should tell you EXACTLY how full of shit OP is.


broke_the_bat

Game is going to die so fast if they don't sort this out.


PizzaParker62

It's really not, regardless of what the reddit hivemind would have you believe.


HankTheYank27

Out of about 20 friends who play Halo, I am the only one who even plays more than 3 days a week on average and most of them don't play more than 1 day a week for maybe a couple of hours. I myself stop playing every week after the weeklies are done. Not much point. Player retention is just as important as sales.


Carcerking

Yeah, I see player base falling pretty quick once people complete the pass honestly. If they buy it in the first place. The game is immensely fun, but for a live game you have to be very ready to support everything with content or else people will move on quick.


MobileVortex

Haha


Mokoo101

But guys it took a long time for MCC to get to the stage its at now as Ske7ch said! Its not like they could have used the lessons learned there and applied them from the start with infinite that is just silly and logical, its going to take time for infinite to get to a point where everyone is happy /s Buckle up bois, going to be shit for a while until they consider the whales successfully and thoroughly milked


starcraftre

Is it correct to measure absolute progress like this to make a conclusion? If you do relative progress, things look a bit different: 466 tiers out of 700 in MCC is 66.6% progression in 115 hours. That's 0.58% of the way to the end per hour. 54 tiers out of 100 in Infinite is 54% progression in 103 hours. That's 0.52% of the way to the end per hour. Compared, that means MCC is ~10% faster to total completion than Infinite so far - that number goes up every time a season of Infinite is added. But even that isn't a great way to compare things. Each Season of MCC adds 100 items as I can tell (for now - who knows whether 343 drops that off to encourage moving to Infinite or not). Hypothetically, keeping the same ratios (and assuming seasons release at the same time and last the same duration), after Season 2 of Infinite, MCC will be 48% faster to completion. After Season 3, 61% faster. Now, granted, there's probably way more content in 700 tiers of MCC than in the 100 tiers of Infinite. I say probably because (that I am aware of), each tier of MCC gives you one item. Infinite depends on Free vs Premium BP, but from what I can see (and calling challenge swaps + XP boosts to be nothing instead of an actual tier reward), there are 26 items in free BP, and 91 in the premium BP for 100 tiers. Some of those are mirror (e.g. L/R shoulders), so taking those "duplicates" out, it's 5 less, or a total of 112 items in 100 tiers. Further complicating this are the backdrops and nameplates that in MCC are typically earned by challenges like "beat the Par Time on The Library", etc. Removing those (which I'm conflicted on - some of those MCC nameplates are actually a ton of work) gives 105 items for Infinite. Then we get to coatings (which are directly comparable to color selection from MCC). There's 11 of those, bring us down to 94 items in 100 tiers. Assuming the same approximate ratio for future seasons, after season 7 there'd be 658 items in 700 tiers, and you'd play 4032 (311 games x 7 seasons / 54%) games to get them. This doesn't change your conclusion in any way, shape, or form. But just giving an absolute numbers comparison is kind of misleading. You can very easily misrepresent actual trends by only using absolutes.


ELVEVERX

a few problems with this 1. I believe they have already stated they aren't counting their campaign time but they did get PVE achievements so the rate of MCC should be slower. 2.MCC only gives you unlocks up until rank 100 meaning progress gets slower where as infinites rate stays the same 3. This isn't taking into account the season event which also unlock additional stuff.


starcraftre

Oh, absolutely. I think a full and true comparison of the two tier lists and earning methods is prohibitively complex for a simple reddit post. You'd probably need to dedicate a few days to a spreadsheet to get a decent representation, and even then you're going to have to do some iffy assumptions to approximate ease of earning different PvE things from MCC. For example, beating the par time on Regret is no easy task. I think I spent about 3 hours replaying that level, just to try and get all the grenade skips in, and I only just barely cleared the 15 minute mark. So, that's 3 hours of work for what would be a single tier reward. You'd have to weight a lot of those to figure out exactly what they're worth comparatively. You might be able to borrow True Achievements' weighting system (luckily, many of those nameplates are tied to achievements), but a lot of it's going to be subjective.


swozzie_

You should've just said 117 hours You should've just said 117 hours


HankTheYank27

Lol I thought about it XD Think I would've gotten twice the upvotes? Don't know if you've noticed but some people are really pissed that the numbers I listed don't perfectly add up (which I corrected) so something gives me the feeling that someone would've doxed my Halo stats over that slight exaggeration. Reddit man. I've been a lurker for years and this is why.


Hollowregret

im low key thinking that they made progression so slow because they knew they legit had nothing else to hold player retention past the battle pass and if people finished for free too fast everyone would move on. MCC is packed full of like 6 games worth of content too so its a bit unfair to fully compared MCC to where infinite is at currently imo. That being said i 100000% agree with you that everything in MCCs progression system is better in every single way.


echolog

BuT iNfInTe MuLtIpLaYeR iS fReE!?!? Except that the campaign is still being sold for $60. And we sitll have to pay for the battlepass to get practically anything. And the battlepass has had most of the best items removed to sell separately on the store for even more than the battlepass itself costs as a whole. If I had to choose between spending $60 on a complete game with like 20 basic colors/armors and some basic customization and getting the game for free but having over $1,000 (which is such an ABSURD number and its the FIRST SEASON) worth of microtransactions then I'd absolutely go with the former.


BushyOreo

I'm at 88 hours played and lvl 62. You're doing something wrong


Whales_of_Pain

Parallelism is your friend.


XXMAVR1KXX

I dont know if thats right.. Now im not saying the system is perfect, just this past weeks update made it better than what it was. In the first 2 weeks i made it to a level 14. This past week with the new XP and only using a double exp once I am now at a level 30. I doubled my progression in half the amount of time. ​ EDIT: I also need ot add this past week is the first time i made it through the weekly ultimate. I didnt have any challenges like destroy 5 warthogs or anything like that. I only had to use 1 challenge swap when I needed a kill form the disrupter and for some reason it would not give it to me even after multiple kills with the dam thing.


sikaxis

I'm at 66 hours and level 50. Not a terrible pace if I'm being honest. HOWEVER, I do understand that I have done so by having to go out of my way regardless of the match objective. And grinding bot arena to take down those challenges as fast as possible. It's not as annoying for me, but I know for others it's not why they play halo. Challenges def need to be less specific.


lordpugfart

I played Vanguard for the first time Saturday for 18 hours. Not only did I prestige, I leveled up my battlepass (free one I didn't buy it) from 1-40. That's on one days game time with their double xp weekend.


sickophanticbanana

It’s meant to last 3 months. Not less than 1.


Prefix-NA

MCC progression is not faster you are counting steam time for Infinite and only multiplayer time in game in MCC and ignoring ur campaign challenges as well. You only get 100 for the first 100 ranks. After that its only from weeklies. In MCC to get 100 unlocks it takes a minimum of 9 weeks because you can only get 12 boxes max per week. After 8 weeks u get 96 boxes. If you get more than 12 boxes a week in Infinite its faster to level up in Infinite.


inFINN1te

This may seem true in theory but definitely not in practice. The fact is, those first 100 levels do count on top of the 12 points you can get a week. That's a huge boost even if it's not permanent. Also, seasonal challenges are 3-4 points a pop and added up on top of weeklies.


Prefix-NA

Only for the first 100. For the next 550 unlocks it doesn't help. And Season challenges won't even pay for the 20 point bundle each season adds. U get about 16 from season.


inFINN1te

My point is while getting those 100 levels you're gonna be getting plenty of weeklies along the way. And I love how you're trying to compare getting all 8 entire seasons to the one season in Infinite. Yeah its still gonna take a long ass time to get all 8 seasons completely filled out on top of the stuff in the shop. It should. But you get a ton of shit for your time in MCC.


Rickiar

you unlocked about half if the tiers in both, i don't see what is the problem


__Etiquette

Go out side once in a while.


GuiltyAir

Pretty much in the same boat


FlaccidSponge

Some Facebook commenter tried telling me he already got to Tier 100 without spending any money, I am about to send him this post and see what he says.


Therad1239

Maybe you’re just not good. Haven’t bought anything am lvl 36 with 45 hours played


IIII-bRian-IIII

Just to confirm, I've completed every challenge given to me since "beta" launch and have only used the 2 XP grants earned in the Tenrai event and I'm sitting at rank 30 today. No double XP boosts of any kind.


Barbarian_Sam

Where are y’all checking your time in game?


OSC95

Are you on Xbox? If so it's really hard to find. Go to your profile and then switch to the gaming tab. The games you've played should pop up and if you click on one of them you can switch to the game's stats. Edit: You can also check halotracker.com


ebagdrofk

I have about half your hours but am near the same level. I also had a 12 pack of rockstars with infinite codes so I had a couple dozen xp boosts to use lol, those obviously help.


Legal-Badger2845

I'm having so much on Infinite that I can't even begin to cry about pointless cosmetics


Kalikovision64

I didn't enjoy mcc as much as I enjoy infinite. And since season 1 is gonna last as long as it is, I don't mind my progression. Mine mostly in line with yours. I maybe have 90 hours, level 52 or something. But it's been a great 90 hours. Versus mcc I lost interest very fast.


wartitan007

I prefer Halo Reach's exp system where you get credits for things you do naturally in a match like getting killing sprees, getting head shots,and completing a match. You always got a bunch exp per match even if you lost. Honestly, Reach's exp system should've been standard.


IdentiFriedRice

Weird. I have half the time and games, and I'm at tier 40. I think based on how efficiently people use the 2x XP will vary the unlock rates, but I'm in no rush since this is the only battle pass until May


Jesse1198

I have 40 hours and am at tier 35


HellNaw98

“Win this war” bruh


OSC95

I've played 174 matches in 28 hours and I'm level 29 on the battlepass. How did I manage to play more than half the amount of matches you did in less than 1/3rd of the time? Do you play big team a lot?


mems1224

It's been a month and you're halfway through a 6 month battlepass and you're crying? Lmao


God_Damnit_Nappa

Jesus I wish I had the free time needed to put in 100 hours of gameplay over 3 weeks.


[deleted]

Jesus can we let the game be out for a month before we start comparing progression.


QuinSanguine

Yea, there's definitely too much grind. I mean I ain't angry or anything, it's just a game in the end, but 343 needs to find a better middle-ground between what we have now and had.


watertowerdrew_2

You’re comparing a game that has been out for 7 years to one that *technically* hasn’t even launched yet. Changes will come, 343 has definitely been listening. I understand we all have one problem or another with this game, but it is what it is. You can’t magically change what the system is like with the snap of a finger. Game development takes a lot of time, especially when rebuilding your progression system. Yes yes I know “but it’s been in development for 6 years” and “why didn’t they listen to our flight feedback?” You know what those statements change? Absolutely nothing. The game is still the same, and is how it is. It will be fixed. Patience is a virtue.


Spatetata

> **Did I mention that all 700 of MCC's battle pass tiers are 100% FREE with no in game purchases?** That’s why it’s easier. It’s not a monetized live service


TheOhrenberger

I don’t believe you. Your math doesn’t add up at all. How on earth do you have 12 more hours of MCC but have played 3x the number of matches. And no, your explanation doesn’t make anything any better. You posted those metrics in your title for a reason. You wanted to call attention to that comparison specifically. I have what must be considerably more time in MCC than you since the new progression was added in and I don’t think I’m as far through progression as you. I think you’re either lying or being intentionally misleading.