T O P
TheBlackestIrelia

Oh i'm glad that this stupid 35 ping rule that shouldn't even be included is just going to make things worse. lol


FornhubForReal

First Impact now Faker talking about unstable ping on stage. Hope this will be addressed soon.


6antai

[Oner said something similar as well, on how the ping was from the hotel vs on the stage.](https://twitter.com/whppd1/status/1523998189044768773)


[deleted]

Riot is so fking scummy. RNG players don't have cams. In addition, MSI rulebook states players can only use MSI provided headsets, but RNG players are using whatever they want. IDK if RNG even had referees at their facility, lmao.


Villifraendi

China gives absolutely no fucks what the Riot rules are, Riot plays by Chinas rules.


DeDiRan

LPL didnt even want to participate in this MSI and I dont think they should. As a LPL fan, I like to see them play in MSI but I think the circumstances dont allow them to. You need to understand that shanghai is still under lockdown and government now is trying to prevent people leaving the country. Not sure if this is the case for RNG, but a lot people still locked in their home and people dont allow to enter or leave the community. One positive case gonna lock the whole community for a month. Under those circumstances, RNG played only because Riot WANTED to have them played online for viewership. If there is anyone to blame, it is Riot, not RNG or China.


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S-Kotus

Same company that owns league also owns reddit, be careful


obvious_bot

Yes a whole 5% of it. I’m shaking in my boots


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FreedomVIII

Tianaman Triangle? Maybe some other polygon?


IMT_Justice

I'd rather stay where I am. Thank tho


seby44

You clearly have no idea what it's like in Shanghai right now lol. Nobody is allowed to leave their apartments. They can't leave the team house for any reason, nobody is allowed to enter either so no referee is allowed in the building. They aren't able to recieve deliveries to get the MSI headsets. They do have cameras in the room as shown on the stream. Riot can't overrule *the Chinese government*.


Mithix-the-Shattered

Well then RNG can't play this year. That's as simple as it should be. If they can't attend the same venue as everybody else, if their gear in unverified, if there's no ref, if their environment is different than other teams and matches and their ping is different than other teams and matches, it's not a fair competition. I don't give a fuck if it's the Chinese government's fault or not. If they can't play by the same rules everybody else does they shouldn't be in the competition.


Puppetsama

I honestly agree. If VCS had to take a 2? year break for the same reasons mentioned, LPL should as well. It's about upholding the integrity of the sport here.


Rarghala

except VCS doesnt give 300 million viewer to the event like china does.. You (we all do tbh) know something something money


conemo

to be honest rng not being able to play is the fairest decision. thats a pity for lol fans but that scenario is even better than what we have now. we would be also hyped about a non major region in the 6 team bo1 round, and a new face in the semis


raptearer

How could they get refs there? Shanghai is in a major lockdown, people can't even leave their homes, let alone get in.


nroproftsuj

Could be input lag from the on-stage monitors. Certain monitor settings can easily add ~10ms input lag.


pepecachetes

Man if riot were using some shit tier monitors it would be beyond embarrasing, no way its monitor input lag


Monk_Breath

It would also be peak riot decision making


Sparious_

from what I've seen they're using the Alienware AW2521HF monitors with different stands. They're expensive af and there have been no reports of great input lag


ChipAnndDale

Impact made a very good example in an interview about this, he compared it to a soccer player who had a broken foot and all other soccer players having to wear sandbags on their feet to even out playing grounds, I still find it unbelievable that Tencent punishes all teams and the overall viewing experiences just for the shortcoming of a single team... meanwhile VCS having same issue for 2 years and i'm sure nothing remotely similiar was ever discussed...


enejejehe

Turns out when a certain country makes up 90% of your business, they get certain preferential treatment


ImAlemira

Makes sense from a business perspective, but I'd be real worried about what signals thats gonna send. The integrity of Lol esports kinda went out the window with this one imo


TheBlackestIrelia

My first thought about the catch out during t1's first game in bot lane was ping. Like i don't see why Guma flashed so late under any other situation.


braenbaerks

>First Impact now Faker talking about unstable ping on stage. Impact was talking about scrim ping wasn't he? Saying it felt more like the 70ms he gets in NA. Hopefully the stage is 35ms as intended rather than even higher or something.


ChristianEmboar

Flakked texted in Esportmaniacos chat today that it felt like they were playing at 80ms on stage Sooooo. Yeah competition rigged to make China win lul


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thanhame

LPL not playing? Everyone having to compromise to accommodate the LPL is making fans of several other regions unhappy and LPL teams and fans even said that they were willing to sit this MSI out. It's Riot that insist on having the LPL for viewership. I'm not even sure if the Chinese and RNG fans are happy with this arrangement either.


Mogician_

Not having LPL participating makes the tournament less validated. On the other had not having VCS participating worlds won't affect much. Think about why. Simply imagine MSI without LCK.


raelusd

people on this sub are mostly teenager and they dont have maturity to understand that sometimes the situation is fucked and you do the best you can do and its what it is. MSI itself is already a boring tournament as you only have 4/5 top teams and only 3 bo5. Just imagine how fucking boring and irrelevant this tournament without any of the top 4 regions? legit stupid to even supose that would be better than teams having ping problems stability, etc.


Mogician_

Exactly. The tournament just feels more lame if any of eu na lpl or lck is missing.


RagoatFS

Agree, you need all four regions. If LPL didn't come, people would complain that it means nothing to win MSI. They would wonder why they couldn't just use a low ping setup like CN players playing on the KR server.


NeymarBangsHisSister

> I'm not even sure if the Chinese and RNG fans are happy with this arrangement either. I imagine they are not because it sets a precedent for future regions. When MSI or worlds gets hosted in China and the Taiwanese players can't get to China in time or are banned from doing so (They get travel bans for different reasons even since before covid), or when idk... a competing org from Germany can't go to Worlds or MSI, the LPL, Koreans and everyone else will have to play with around 40 to 80 ping. This only hurts the top dogs (Koreans, Chinese, EU, some NA players who actually play soloq (Impact and his zoomers), etc) who have the mechanics and reaction times to actually use the advantage of no latency. I feel like LPL really intended to sit this one out, for their own good since this precedent will hurt the Chinese and Korean regions the most while everyone else will, granted, unwillingly, use it as an advantage. EU and NA are used to play in 30 ping, hell, even 50 is playable for them, they were molded by 30 ping, dont even get me started on NA. Koreans and Chinese are the only ones losing from it from a strictly competitive standpoint, but if I have to bet, this went to a vote between the CEOs of every competing team and everyone voted to go ahead with this "fix" as long as China's astronomical numbers were there watching the tournament. At the end of they day every team and Riot themselves wants their sponsors and their brand to be seen by as many eyes as possible, it's just business.


TheBlackestIrelia

LPL doesn't even care about MSI so i don't see why we have to compromise everything for them. I literally do not care if the winner of MSI didn't' have to play LPL to win. I'd rather the games be played in a good environment without them rather than potentially shitty one with them (where they even have the advantage lol)


ButterflyHaunting102

No they are not, LPL fans care little about MSI, especially RNG fans.(LPL won 2 MSI and 1 MSC in the past 4 years, with RNG having two MSi trophies already but no worlds) LPL offered to sit out the tournament, and Riot offered this solution trying to get them back.


Deckowner

If LPL doesn't play then the tournament title will forever be tainted. whoever wins will be remembered as "the team that got lucky and didn't have to face lpl to win MSI".


FornhubForReal

I'm not even that bothered by the 35 ping itself. Sure it sucks, but unstable ping is a straight up desaster.


fanasup

Won’t matter till someone from lpl say something


[deleted]

meanwhile LCS fans have their home NA server at stable 70 ping on good day


HallowSingh

I used to be 120 on EST server. Then they moved servers and now I’m at a good 35.


danieldag10

I get 70 ping playing on NA servers in Florida. I play with my cousin on LAN sometimes and I get 15 ping…


jaehaneul

because those servers are (or maybe used to be) in southern florida


ILikePulloverHoodies

i used to get 140 from FL and now i get like 48 lmao


Doctor_What_

Back when riot's servers were in the east coast, right around the time the LLA servers launched, I used to get like 70-120 ping in LAN, and ~40 on the NA server. Playing from Mexico. Fun times! edit: the difference between 70 and 40 ping was insane even for a silver scrub like me, can't imagine how pros are dealing with this nonsense.


lefondler

I used to get around 20-30ms on west coast back in the day. After the server move, I'm now around 70ms constantly. Fucking hell.


SeptimusAstrum

The NA serve is stable, the ping essentially never changes. It's just that the country is huge and the serve is far from the LCS studio, so pros have like 60 ping. I'm in Boston meanwhile, and have 40 ping basically always. The server move was a godsend for the east coast. Had 85 ping before...


Himbler12

so annoying, I used to enjoy 20-30 ms and now I get 80-90. I used to play in upper diamond before the switch and now I struggle to get into plat :D


SeptimusAstrum

I mean... You can absolutely get to dia with just macro on a simple champ - > Draven flair Ah, nevermind, have a good day


TechnalityPulse

Yeah idk I played to diamond 1 (pre Masters existing) on 80-120 ping. I actually even played Draven back on that ping, before his bugs became blatantly game breaking. It'd probably be harder now but you can be challenger with 100 ping. Ping as an excuse when everyone is on / near the same ping is a bad excuse. It does affect international play, but adjusting for ping isn't something that takes months/years. Playing like 5 days on a ping is enough, aside from very specific champs like Jayce that has insane low-ping combos that are hard to match on anything above 30 ping.


Funny_witty_username

I live in rural AZ, I went from 60 to 95. It was infuriating at first, now its just a sad reality.


weshouldgoback

I played on 70 in California for awhile after playing on 30 most of my time and it made me want to quit. If I was at 95 I would just flat out not play.


nazaguerrero

they would be: "first time?" to faker comments xd


[deleted]

I’ve never played below 160 ping before and normally spend 1/6th ish of my game ping spiking to 1000+ ping. I legit have to pay a monthly subscription fee to a ping booster to be able to log into the game. My fault for playing NA servers from Hong Kong tho because english is the only language i understand and rito doesnt have allow language changing for some reason.


RivenYeet

You can change client language from files, im eu but played on ru and turkey that way, google it up, theres a config file where you need to edit one line pretty much.


[deleted]

my average ping in NA is 23ms, crazy to think pros will be playing on higher than that for a major tournament


Sorest1

23ms is a really good ping that you should be very happy for.


PaintItPurple

I mean, NA pros normally play on much higher ping than that.


Razihelz

I play on 10 ping on average


my_favorite_story

I know they are not used to thinking of tier lists based on bad mechanics, so they need our help! We monkeys need to tell them the Bronze tier list where no one can dodge skill shots and no one flashes Malphite max range ults.


[deleted]

I'm sure there are legends here who will miss Garen ult xD


veilsofrealitydotcom

I can do that


Alcibiades_Rex

I Garen ulted a wukong clone yesterday!


Soulless_redhead

You rang?


Elden_Bonk

Just saw Impact's interview and I've gotta say, this thing is shaping up to be a shitshow.


Sejjy

how come? genuinely curious regarding Impact.


Best-StreamerNA

Impact also said that instead of 35, it feels a lot higher, like around 70ms. They don’t even know for sure what ping they are playing on


Doctor_What_

Tinfoil hat time: riot hard coded the ping to show 35, but it's actually 69. Big brain moves.


Forged_by_Flame

So that's why the chat is now broken. Makes sense.


Hannig4n

The tool that they’re using to artificially inflate the ping for teams in Busan doesn’t work all that well so many of the players are experiencing ping fluctuations and Impact said it sometimes feels like 60-70 ping. Faker said in this interview that T1 is trying to curate strategies that would work best in a high ping environment, because it’s hard for them to execute on the picks they think are the best because of the high ping.


TitanOfShades

Time for all point and click statcheckers.


Hydralius

Garen 100% PB incoming.


BruceMcClaine

I will laugh so hard if the bronze meta become proplay tier


KuttayKaBaccha

Finally, we will get pro tier picks that work in solo queue


Apprehensive_File

I wonder what they're using to enforce the latency. I hope it's not software.


Baxland

I think they have better ping when just playing soloQ or scrims than on stage due to 'artificially increasing ping' by external programs by riot to even the chances for LPL players which are not in korea due to Covid stuff returning. So while at hotel they play on like 10-15 ping while on stage riot aims to artificially increase ping to as close to 35 which is over double the lag of what they practice on. So they are lagging more in official games than soloQ and if you ever had to switch from more stable/lower ping to higher it feels MUCH worse than just being used to higher ping non-stop.


Phoresis

>or scrims Not true, they're meant to have some software or technology provided by Riot to emulate a 35ms ping environment even for scrims, specifically so that they can practice and prepare. The issue is that these players are saying the 35ms ping in scrims doesn't feel the same as the 35ms ping during the tournament ("that he felt the ping during scrims and the ping on stage was different").


syntex00

It is just so dumb too adapt to LPL. It is not Riot issues, that they want to attend Asian games and adapt their schedule. And now even the Asian games were postponed, so they could easily attend MSI. IMO LPL should play on 35 ping and live with the disadvantage. It is not other team's fault, that LPL is bullshitting like this


SatanV3

Well China can’t come cuz Covid not cuz of Asian games But I agree ping shouldn’t punish everyone but idk I understand why riot made that decision


PaintedFog

The way Riot has been going about MSI this year is just a mess.


[deleted]

What about last year? Fucked over DK to give RNG a day more to prep even though it was rightfully DK's reward for being first seed, lmao.


Despure

Also made side selection be a literal coinflip. The coinflip went RNG's way so they got side selection. And all games won were on the same side.


plarc

79% blue side win rate for whole 2021 MSI. Coinflip was the real MVP.


Zerole00

It's kinda dumb at this point that the map isn't mirrored. On a similar note I'd love the option flip the UI so that I'm always 'playing from blue side'. My skillshots are just worse from red side.


ahmeclaw

Blue side is op because you can usually secure a strong first pick


enejejehe

Was op. Teams favor red side now. It’s just a meta thing. When solo lanes have OP picks blue side wins. When Duo picks bot are OP red side wins


TrriF

the reason blue side had higher winrate was draft meta... not the map. there were moments in league competitive history when red side had a much higher winrate because counter pick was much more important than pick priority.


Hannig4n

The problem with blue side last MSI was that there were so many broken lane picks in the meta (Lucian, Lee sin, etc.) that getting one of them first pick was way more valuable than counter picks.


Ajwf

At a pro level it's not "oh mirror the map", a lot of in-game winrate is literally how you approach objectives, something absolutely not solved by mirroring maps. Imagine a pro complaining cuz they can't fucking lockscreen on red side as well lmao.


Alertum

I think the pick order might be more the reason than locations on the game.


MyUshanka

Wild Rift does that


FuckTheFourth

Riot only cares about LPL. If they can fuck over LCK teams to give LPL a better chance, they will.


Jranation

Oh another situation where it favours an LPL team..... fuck this shit


[deleted]

People can say its impossible to tell the difference but i moved from ireland to the netherlands for a year. My ping went from 38 to 16 and i spent the first couple of weeks accidentally locking in TF red cards instead of gold cards. I one trick him and have muscle memory for locking in the gold card as early as possible. With the drop in ping my W press was being processed faster and so it was still a red card when it goes through.


Seranta

This is where I feel majority of people in this thread saying it's excuses completely miss the point. If you play a thousand games on 0 ping and then get forced onto 35 ping, your timing will be off. Muscle memory is a huge part of it. Doesn't matter if someone in here can play on 35ping, that's what their muscle memory is adjusted to.


xNuNux

Fully agree. And it works the other way around aswell. If you are used to 35 ping and suddenly play on 0 ping, it feels weird.


FreedomVIII

Muscle memory is a hell of a thing. If you want an example of a group of people everyone knows that would be sensitive to a 10 ping difference, musicians would be a good one. That kind of tiny difference can lead to all sorts of issues, especially in fast passages or ensembles.


Miyaor

And try playing jayce when on 60 ping compared to 40. Nothing works properly.


EnmaDaiO

I'm NA west haven't played under 60 ping in closing in on a decade.


Vall3y

Well done riot, you dun goofed it again


ComfortableBite6644

Thats why BB's fiora was complete trash! Right?


unatheworld

it unironically kinda fucked him over, he was 20cs up in lane until he riposte'd a w too early and it was downhill from there


Darki200

Lol that wasn't because of the ping, BB just messed up the timing. He used W a full second earlier


Likept

He wanted to riposte the W, not the W-pull. That's why it seems he did it a second earlier, because in reality he actually just riposted some milliseconds late.


PepperouniKenshin

No, bc there was a q right on his head, if he didn't riposte that he would've been cc chained by w after the knockup. Also that legit has nothing to do with ping, the timing on fiora w isnt that narrow and has nothing to do with reaction speed when looking at aatrox w. He just got outplayed in a winning match-up nothing more to it


BurningApe

BB literally plays on ~30 ping all the time in EU, how the fk is he not used to it


getjebaited

because it's 70-80 ms not 35 ms ping like lots of pros have said already (Impact, Oner, Flakked, Faker)


[deleted]

any person who played league long enough can definitely feel as low as a 10 ping difference I can definitely feel the difference between 10 ping, some might feel the difference from 20 ping its not surprising to me this guy who played thousands of games yearly at the top level can feel a 5 ping difference


b_ootay_ful

*\*laughs in 200 ping* Ah you think lag is your ally? You merely adopted the lag . I was born in it, molded by it. I didn't see my ping until I was already a man, by then it was nothing to me but rubber banding!


reyxe

Well, Quas got to be a pro playing from fucking Maracaibo with 200 ping plus random blackouts lmao


imtheproof

I'd like to see a blind test done between a *stable* 10ms and 20ms ping. I'd be surprised if people could tell the difference. 1ms and 35ms? Definitely. 10ms and 20ms though I think is below the range where you would be able to tell.


Xey2510

I think they can but you are also giving them favourable conditions. In reality they'll switch between 10 and 20 ping after an hour of not playing and at that point it's definitely harder. But on the spot? You definitely feel it.


justAnotherRandomP

Idk about 5ping but I usually play on 15ms if it goes up to 25 i feel the difference sometimes I get a stable 35ms for no reason and it feels hard to play because im not used to it


callisstaa

I'd take the stable 35 over 15-25ms fluctuating any day. You can adapt to consistently high ping but spikes are the worst.


justAnotherRandomP

Yes definetly, but it s funny to imagine these pros play on like 10ms on the korean server then have to scrim and play on stage on 35


JesusGiftedMeHead

If China gets knocked out early, would the 35 ping remain? 🤔🤔


trivinium

They'll increase it to 80


getjebaited

it's already 80 lol https://youtu.be/E_ATVPvsh20?t=529 https://twitter.com/whppd1/status/1523998189044768773 https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/umf3zd/faker_teams_will_need_to_adapt_to_the_meta_based/i83n7se/


HawkEye1337

They are practicing on 35 ping so it will probably stay that way.


FudgyDidders

No according to my uncle who owns riot games


PurloinerofCinders

But some Redditors told me there is hardly any difference in 8 and 35.


Hannig4n

It’s funny that people are still trying to argue against this when Impact did such a good job talking through specific examples of where this ping makes a difference in his recent interview.


ManinderThiara07

Cant argue with that logic. Reddit for sure knows better than a noob like faker. /s


SnooChickens7571

Idd who does this guy think he is???


Mobshigoo

Faker's laning was evidently affected by this as the rest of his team, he's played that Sylas TF matchup countless times vs better midlaners smoothly but this one was rough


Ashankura

Because normally he sidesteps a lot of sylas e2 casts. I think he ate all of them this game


UndeadMurky

The most shocking was people being unable to react to alistar lol


Phoresis

Not just people - guma fucking usi, the mechanical god The 35ms ping itself is probably not a massive issue, but if what the players are saying about the onstage ping being unstable and fluctuating, then that's a massive problem. Add to that the fact that faker/impact said 35ms in scrims feels different to the 35ms on stage, and its a recipe for disaster. Hopefully production can sort it out fast.


Greentea_Sloth

I've seen Guma's lucian sidestep 4 diff ulties coming from 4 directions at the same time on solo q. Normal ping guma would've easily dodged a predictable alistar engage


Superbrah66

Yeah I am still really excited to see him play, but it will be a shame if he can’t show off his mechanics to the best of his ability because of ping issues. I’m a completely average skilled player and I notice when my ping shoots up from the consistent 40 I get. It doesn’t happen often, but it my ping shoots up to 70 or so I think that accidentally hit the DPI button on my mouse.


Mobshigoo

exactly


HarambesRightHand

Joe marsh literally said on interview that faker gumayusi are struggling to adjust to this 35 ping the most in scrims because they’d re the most skill shot reliant mechanical movement players


TheBlackestIrelia

Well yea, Faker has played like 10 years under 10ms ping, and he is supposed to somehow just transition to this shit ping only for this tournament...? If they do well then i'd bet they do terrible the summer split as they have to go back. If they do badly now people are going to say their 20-0 streak was some kind of fluke and that the LCK is weak. Its dumb.


FreedomVIII

LS was saying the exact same thing as your first sentence. Muscle memory built over a decade can't just be changed overnight for one tournament (only to need to be changed back afterward).


Mostdakka

Anyone who ever played in lan enviroment will know that it makes huge diffrence. Its hard to describe but its completely diffrent experience from playing online.


my_favorite_story

I like to describe the difference as trying to dodge a skill shot with and without ghost on.


Iquey

Not only that, but the reactiveness of your abilities. It just happens as soon as the button is pressed instead of near instantly. The difference is definitely felt.


tabben

I get 30-35 ping most times on EUW and those rare times when it gets to 60ish you definitely feel its not nearly as responsive. Anyone who claims you cant tell a difference is just lying or clueless themselves. Experiencing 8-10ms on league would be pretty sweet


Jranation

Bruh the people on reddit think they know better than the pros.


dimagreens

And league redditors have literal brain damage.


Khurpacajdjb

I saw people getting downvoted to hell on that first thread (where they announced the set up), for suggesting that the meta could in any way be shaped off 35 ping, or that the tournament in any way has an asterisk hanging over it. It's honestly as though half the sub is a paid-by-Riot hivemind.


my_favorite_story

I mean, when their brain already has 500 ping lag, the difference between 508 and 535 will not be that noticeable for them.


Chrisabolic

>Translation: Faker said that the ping is different from normal circumstances, which will affect the champion tier list. Faker also mentioned that he can feel differences as small as 5 ping, and that he felt the ping during scrims and the ping on stage was different. Well to be fair, you and me will probably not gain that much of that ping difference compare to the pros, especially the GOAT himself.


Thisconnect

It literally doesn't matter if there is difference, its inexcusable for people in venue to play on ping, just play from hotel at that point


SageTal

I do agree that LPL had to be at MSI, but they should've done a better job to further solidify the integrity of the tournament. Did you see how RNG players were playing? No white-noise blasting headsets, no ref, no camera on during the game, nothing. One player didn't even have headset on but just one earphone on his right ear or something.


Fley

I can feel the difference between 50 and 60 ping here in Miami. The difference between in Valorant of 30-50 is also huge. So to go from 7-10 ping to 35 would definitely affect your muscle memory. PS: anyone play in South Florida and know how to get under 50-60 ping? For other games im around 25-40 but for league im always around 50


Javiklegrand

So i Guess no ezreal


SamsungBaker

His opinion doesn’t matter What matter the most is how RNG feel and we should do our best to please RNG


Braell

Also its weird af that chinesse players dont even have facecams.. meanwhile the team playing at the venue have to experience every little discomfort that comes with it


bananaholy

They did have cams. But probably not even plugged in LOL. They showed live cam AFTER the game. And not once during the game.


nc_bruh

True. Otherwise Daddy China will spank us and take away weekly allowance.


brensterrr

First is the last year MSI where in DK finish first but have to play the toughest schedule due to RNG tight schedule with quarantine. Seriously this is just plain ridiculous.


Full_Environment_205

And I can see that there is no face cam or referee in RNG gaming house while the game ‘s happening. I told you if Faker retires, I’ll stop playing or watching this game :))


Aheg

I am playing now with 26 ping, but for some stupid reason for one day like a month ago I had 65 ping. I felt like I can't play because of lags. Funny thing is I used to play with 80 ping non stop for years.


idontgiveaseat

He also mentioned that he couldn't react to Alistar's WQ combo with his stopwatch because of the high ping. This could be why Guma-Keria died so much to enemy Alistar in the lane. (Them dying during the laning phase almost never happened in LCK). It seems likely that hard-engage champions will be the meta this MSI.


JustForPotm

By that logic, I think no one in NA solo queue can dodge Ali WQ combo.


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nroproftsuj

Yes. It is hard to **react** dodge Ali WQ on high ping. It is impossible to **react** dodge Ali Flash Q on high ping. You have to predict, which is what most players do. Faker is a player capable of doing [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2mzK4RpdAM) and has even reacted to Gragas' flash E on stage before (one of the games vs. Clid last year iirc). Gumayusi's reaction time is no joke either, probably on par or better than Faker's. Not far fetched to say he might have been able to flash or E react to most of those Alistar engages. E: Oner and Faker are also claiming a difference in ping on-stage vs. during practice. Faker says there is a ping difference. Oner says ping is the same but it feels slower. Could be some kind of [input lag](https://www.cclonline.com/article/1906/Guide/Monitors/What-is-monitor-latency-Input-lag-and-why-it-matters-in-gaming-/) with the on-stage monitors.


Burpmeister

There is definitely a difference between 35 and what they're used to but thousands of Ali WQ combos are dodged every single day even on 100 ping.


nroproftsuj

Those are predictions. Nobody on 100 ping is dodging that upon seeing the animation go off.


tabben

similarly most players in lower elos are not able to avoid malphite ulti unless they are predicting it no matter what ping =D


bigmanorm

every time a malphite is in the game against me, i realise that i don't focus anywhere near my potential in every other match, playing aram against him literally makes me fatigued from focusing so hard to flash react lol


tabben

yeah same I can even predict that he is definitely gonna ult in the next few seconds and still my brain will sometimes lag just that split second and I still get caught by it


Wookeke

If I, a low Plat noob, can feel the difference between 15ms and 35ms, people like Faker for sure will.


Alibobaly

No no no you don’t understand, Faker is simply wrong here. NA haters have told me multiple times already that ping doesn’t matter. Checkmate Faker, whoever you are.


EnmaDaiO

Ye sorry faker if NA never gets a pass for playing on shit ping for almost a decade now neither do you.


Jranation

I trust faker that the people on reddit. Y'all be sipping that copium still


RisottoPensa

I already play with 35 ping in EU, but even i know that a fraction of second is what differes from landing a skillshot or dodging one, resulting in death or victory. Hope in the future there will be no things like ping balance


QuirkyTurtle-meme

I can confirm the difference of 30+ ping is bonkers, I used to play on 80-90 ms and the transition to 30 ms is very noticeable, I could react better, see animations better and outplay better.


Tozu1

Riot with the good ol' buff china and nerf everyone else strat. I guarantee they would not lag everyone else if it was for anyone but CN. CN already plays with 30 ping for kr soloq for a decade.


tsukinohime

Riot really wants LPL to win.


diematrosen

I don’t think Riot necessarily wants LPL to win but they sure do want the LPL team playing at MSI because regardless of what people think, MSI without the LPL representative is going to bring wayyyyyy less viewers. It just sucks how the circumstances became what it is but it is what it is.


2Caru

Is there any reason why other teams should do that for China?


AFLe5

Who and what? We only care about China here! If LPL wants to play on 35 then play on 35 We don’t care if it ruins the competitive integrity, China happy Riot is happy


Dragull

>If LPL wants to play on 35 then play on 35 Pretty sure every single player would prefer to play on 0 ping.


CapnJustin

LPL would prefer to play than not play, so they prefer 35 ping


brensterrr

I think i would trust reddit guys out here saying ping doesnt really matter than this guy. Who tf is faker anyway.


Starkheiser

BrokenBlade was doing some very questionable W with his Fiora game 1, I wonder if that had anything to do with ping as well.


bahramfzl

Double standard is really cringe, I personally lost the little hype I had after this fiasco.


Pokemon_Only

Even last year where Riot privileged RNG with the schedule mess up, real shady riot.


noholdsbarred-

Yeah everyone will need to adapt. At least this wasn't one of those pre-tournament patch situations. Every tournament naturally develops its own meta as it goes on, so it'll be interesting to see how this "35 ping" meta shapes up.


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Supr3me_T

Yes


Amxricaa

Imagine being so good that you can tell 5 ping difference, I can’t even keep mine stable around 20 ping


FireDevil11

I have a question. If LPL is eliminated early, do they continue to play on 35 ping or do they go back to 0 ping ?


seanbentley441

Meanwhile I've been on a consistent 60ms for like 6 years lol


S7EFEN

meanwhile NALCS "yeah 60 ping is fine for soloq bro XD" server move was rly cringe that is all.


Sowlid

What a shit MSI


goatman0079

And here I am, in na, playing a Russian roulette of if my game is going to be 50, 65, 70 or 75 ping


sieer

Oh it just dawned on me, is there a chance that this years worlds will be also moved to Korea (or lower chance to china)? Cause it very well could be possible that china would still have current regulations by the time worlds rolls around. And they for sure won’t have them play with 300 ms to na.


Marikaqq

I hope T1 just withdraws from the tournament. It would be a good statement to the bs going on in this tournament.


Coldhimmel

it's ok to play with 60-70 ping but the constant packet loss and varying ping will fuck you up real hard, i tell you it's extremely hard to play in these conditions. you will struggle to even cs properly


jixxor

Man I am so out of the loop. Why is ping an issue all off a sudden? Can't remember having heard of ping as an issue in competitive play once in 12 or so years before?


jsvn8180

Cause LPL cannot come to Korea to play on LAN due to China's COVID guidelines. Riot came up with a stupid idea to artificially increase the ping of every team to 35 other than China to allow China to play with "competitive integrity" in a remote circumstance with their natural 35 ping. Which is really funny because according to multiple pro players, the artificial ping is likely to be extremely funky, and actually outputs 50+ ping rather than 35.


Akashi_Bakamaru

I am very disappointed in this MSI 2022 season. There is a clear and undue bias towards the LPL-RNG (RNG is for Riot Never Give Up; it's funny). I won't be watching any matches between now and the end of MSI 2022. \#boycottMSI2022


ToothGlobal6744

League esports sucks now. It's all about business. Riot, shame on you


Solution93724

This thread is just showing reddit being reddit LMAO


kagalibros

It is a fuckin shitshow. MSI is officially the fuckin Smackdown WWE of LoL. I can personally tell you that Faker is a 100% on it. 0 Ping is worlds apart from 5ms Ping. It is like a curve tho, like 35ms ping is not too different than 40 or even 50ms but 0 to 5 is like a magnitude of 50 to 100ms difference. I have played in korea for 2 months and it was worlds apart from my 20ms I have at home in northern germany and playing close to Frankfurt where the EUW server sits with your sub 12ms... I even played Garena Server in Vietnam for collectivly 6 months over 10 years with anywhere between 35 and 55ms. SEA internet is quite something and it depends on the lan cafe you frequent there. (Shoutouts and RIP Boba Net, the old home of GAM formally Boba Marines. their Fried Rice was cheap and delicious as fuck and their 3rd floor had some mad vibes and also the best machines.) If you force faker to play on 35ms, that is 4 worlds apart from lan and 3 from fuckin korean internet. I know that and I am just some fuckin boomer ass who was like 5 seasons D1 back in fuckin 2013 somewhere. Like even today my boomer ass saw some sketchy fuckin scenes where things could have hit if it was LAN. Just look at one of Nauts Hooks in EGs match. Luckily nothing game deciding! Yet. The only team that should be playing 35ms is china. I know the vietnamese community is rn jaded as fuck. I have heard plenty of em saying that its bullshit that china gets remote but the VCS didnt get any. It is alrdy a huge privilege that they get to participate, to then drag EVERYONE down is a huge fuckin bummer and if Riot is willing to do that, how willing are they to just shift a few things behind our back to let china win as much as possible because Tencent owns Riot and Riot favors china.